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sam wrote:1. herpes simplex virus type 1, previously thought to be the cause of ulceration primarily on tne vermillion border of the lip.
2. herpes simplex virus type 2, previously thought to be the cause of ulceration primarily on the genitalia.
Due to obvious sexual practices type 1 and 2 can be found in either location.
3. herpes zoster (Bug's CORECTION: It is the varicella virus) virus is a type of herpes virus that causes chicken pox. It remains dormant in the dorsal root gangion and if activated causes a painful cluster of ulcerations along the path of the dermatione (nerve root distribution) that is activated. Thus the characteristic "barrel stave" distribution on the trunk, or involvement of the trigeminal nerve with involvement of the 1st branch going to the eye, the 2nd branch going to the cheek or the 3rd going to the jaw.
Secondary complications of Zoster (BUG's Edit: i.e., SHINGLES) are post herpetic neuralgia - severe pain after healing of the lesions, and less common involvement of the central nervous system.
Testing is I think still via immunofluorescence. Culture is unreliable. In the nervous system PCR (polymerase chain reaction) is used. (BLOOD TEST CAN ALSO DETERMINE IF ANTIBODIES ARE PRESENT FOR EITHER TYPE I OR TYPE II HERPES. THIS TEST IS MORE RELIABLE THAN CULTURE TEST BECAUSE THE ANTIBODIES ARE PRESENT EVEN WHEN VICTIM IS NOT IN ACTIVE STAGE.)
So, BUG, what does that mean on your leaf.
a. you don't have zoster/shingles (NOT YET, THANK GOD!)
you won't have post herpetic neuralgia (NOT UNLESS I GET SHINGLES AND DON'T TREAT IT WITHIN 72 HOURS)
b. you might not have herpes simplex (I WAS TOLD I DO; WILL CONFIRM WITH GP DOC THIS WEEK)
the diference between type 1 and 2 is recurrance rate. (IN ADDITION TO TYPE II BEING GENITAL, TYPE I BEING ORAL)
if you do have herpes simplex you have probably had it for years and never known and may
never have it again. (I AM SO HOPING THAT IS THE CASE! I PROBABLY GOT EXPOSED TO IT AS A TEEN.)Stay calm, have your husband rub your feet and we will all send healing vibes to our favorite bug. THANKS SAM!!! My hubby says he'll give me a foot massage - but only wearing rubber gloves and a face mask. ;-) Right now, he is trying to stay optimistic, but since he's never had a cold sore, and was raised in India where herpes was not as common growing up, he *may* be dragged down with me. What can we do? Live in separate bubbles? I am a neatnik, germaphobe and anal about my hygiene. Even more so now. Talk about wild, unprotected sex .... NOT! (Honey, get that saran wrap out, and bring the Clorox wipes!)
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I had a doc tell me years ago (after I found out ex #2 was cheating on me and I went to get a full battery of tests) that the only time the culture for herpes was likely to come back (accurately) positive was when 'fluid' from the blister could be cultured. He said the culture was unreliable, as sam said. I thought Bug might be going to the doc when she had the active blisters so they might be able to culture 'wet' sores. I did not get treated within 72 hours of having shingles as there was no treatment back then, or none that I knew about. I do not have neuralgia in my leg. Neither did my father and I know he had no treatment for his shingles back in the early 70s. My mother did have treatment for hers though. None of us had the neuralgia. I don't think it's a done deal if you have untreated shingles but I don't know why some get it and some don't.
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DCNGA wrote:I had a doc tell me years ago (after I found out ex #2 was cheating on me and I went to get a full battery of tests) that the only time the culture for herpes was likely to come back (accurately) positive was when 'fluid' from the blister could be cultured. He said the culture was unreliable, as sam said. I thought Bug might be going to the doc when she had the active blisters so they might be able to culture 'wet' sores. Yes, that's what I assumed too - it had to be a culture of the fluid. You got any wet sores still Bug?
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As to differential, I'll have to pass on that one as I'm not a derm.
Antibody testing acutely can give false negatives if you've not had the time to develop antibodies.
As the diagnosis of herpes labialis is usually clinical, ie by inspection, I think it is hard to make that dx when someone has had an extensive resurfacing proceedure, drug reaction and if I remember, bacterial infection. With that said valtrex is given for a reason prior to proceedures. If you have HSV you're more likely to have an outbreak.
Type 1 and 2 can be in either location, type 1 being more commonly associated with the mouth but traveling south via oral sex, and thus type 2 traveling north the same way.
My guess is that if you have hsv you have had in for many years without knowing it. Given your concern if you do have active ulcers have them tested. If not wait until your doctor tells you its time for antibody testing. If you are positive the chances for reactivation is low, given your being asymptomatic until stressing your system to the max. As for your husband, people can shed virus without lesions thus passing on the virus to another without knowing they had it themselves. So, my guess is either you both don't have it or you both do.
HSV and HZV are really only my forte when they involve the nervous system (at 3 AM Bug remember yours will not) but I think you will be fine.
Healing vibes on overdrive.
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Bugjune wrote:Wouldn't a health food store also sell the pill form of L-lysine? My doc had said to increase my Vit-C intake ... but when I did that in the first few days after the procedure, it just seemed to give me mouth sores on my tongue really quick.
I will be seeing my GP doc this coming week, too, by God!
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Yes, if it was me, I would keep taking the oral l-lysine. I did ask a naturopathic doctor friend of mine and he said the injectable generally works faster and he usually has his patients do both. Too much oral vitamin C (and even just oranges) can cause canker sores and can absolutely irritate the herpes sores (ouch). Can you take vit C capsules instead of a liquid or chewable format?
"My friends, love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we’ll change the world."
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Home again! After that unsatisfying doc's app't Friday, and gnawing on my nails all weekend over the news about Herpes, at least I have Monday to look forward to and making all those doc app'ts! I honestly can't SEE any fever blisters on my lips or mouth area. But they still have a burning sensation, and I can't open my mouth ALL the way yet, so maybe the doc will see them better with a magnifying glass. I'd bet I don't have a blister big enough to do the culture. And I will ask about the blood antibody test - maybe he'd recommend I come back in a few weeks for that one, as I'd also read about the false results. Meanwhile, I'm continuing with the L-lysine pills and NO extra Vit-C. I read that C actually helps L-lysine do its job against arginine ... but I have found that it does, indeed. give me painful mouth sores almost within hours of taking 500mg or more a day. The good news is that there are not SEVERE side effects to taking just 1250mg of L-lysine daily for several weeks. But thanks guys for ALL YOUR AMAZING advice and those "healing vibes on overdrive"! I just about floored my doc when I suggested Biafine for the redness under my eyes .... he said, "Yes, by all means, it could help the redness. Did you come up with that on your own? I'll have a prescription sent to your local pharmacy." So I told him no, I got it from one of the experts on a plastic surgery message board. I wonder if HE would've suggested anything for this prolonged red skin under my eyes? I'm thinking NOT. I'm just getting less and less satisfied with him over time. And that's too bad, cuz I had great faith in him for all matters concerning my face up till now.
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Poor Bug. That is a tough way to learn something.
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Here's the article from the NYT on the herpes vaccine, btw: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/10/health/10chen.html?ref=health
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And now the latest .... just got off the phone with my MixTo doc who says to also explore the possibility that my "Herpes Type I" may in fact be a candida FUNGAL infection. Evidence? The fever blisters on my lips have been there since about June 2 - which is several days longer than cold sores typically last. Also, I had sheets of skin peeling from my fingertips, palms and bottoms of feet. Thank GOD I have an app't set up for 3pm today with a GP doc (and on Wednesday with a dermatologist), so I'll have a 2nd and 3rd opinion real soon. I was told to ask the doc about checking for candida fungus in addition to doing the blood test for Herpes antibodies. And today, oddly enough, I see the blisters, so perhaps there will be a juicy one ripe for the culture. My god. I can honestly say that even Dr. Livingston didn't experience in the jungles of Africa the HALF of what I've gone through in cosmopolitan USA. When will it be over? When will Martians land?
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Make sure it's an older derm--not the kind that goes into dermatology just to do cosmetic treatments. Differential diagnosis in dermatology is kind of complex and you need someone conversant in skin diseases/conditions that arise from all the different fungi, virus, bacteria, spores, insects etc. Not just someone into dermatology for the cosmetics of it.
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Something else to keep in mind is you can also make an appointment at a skin clinic in a teaching hospital. Not sure if this is any good for you depending on where you live, but there you would get an evaluation from more than one person at the same time. Good luck with this and continued healing thoughts for you.
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I SO completely agree with you!! I am sitting on-hold on the telephone with the derm clinic right now to make sure that is the case. And would you believe I just got disconnected and have to call back again!! PHUCK. I will definitely sleep better once I know at least what I have. I am utterly gun-shy about all medications now. My lips are actually significantly WORSE today, too, which makes me wonder if the Abreva cream I'd been instructed to rub in well to the lips is actually spreading this! In about a week's time, I will probably wake up inside a giant pod attached to a hyacinth in my garden, my body inhabited by an alien. ANYTHING is possible! ================================= MissJ wrote:Make sure it's an older derm--not the kind that goes into dermatology just to do cosmetic treatments. Differential diagnosis in dermatology is kind of complex and you need someone conversant in skin diseases/conditions that arise from all the different fungi, virus, bacteria, spores, insects etc. Not just someone into dermatology for the cosmetics of it.
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That's a good suggestion, and I did find a teaching hospital in my little hick-town area: for veterinary medicine. That's it! Maybe if I crawl in on all fours I could pretend to be a HORSE - albeit an old nag with HERPES. ======================================== stache wrote:Something else to keep in mind is you can also make an appointment at a skin clinic in a teaching hospital. Not sure if this is any good for you depending on where you live, but there you would get an evaluation from more than one person at the same time. Good luck with this and continued healing thoughts for you.
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Are you putting the Abreva on to your fingertips, and then rubbing it in or you putting it on to a spatula or stick, then using your fingers to apply? You may be reinfecting yourself.
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I'd been using freshly-washed fingertip, but I still had your same exact thought! Especially because it seemed my fingertip stayed kind of gummy when I tried washing the Abreva OFF after applying it. I just bought a box of gloves (not latex) for future applications. I've become the Bubble Bug in my sterile, saran-wrapped, rubber gloved, eye goggled, facial masked universe. ======================================== stache wrote:Are you putting the Abreva on to your fingertips, and then rubbing it in or you putting it on to a spatula or stick, then using your fingers to apply? You may be reinfecting yourself.
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